Matthew 2:2 “Saying, where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.”
Today we’re looking at a small portion of an important talk given by Orson Pratt, interspersed with a few questions. The reason this is important is because Mormons are still saying the same things today Mr. Pratt said 148 years ago. You can use this example when witnessing to Mormons as we approach the holidays!
Journal of Discourses 13:126-127 “It can be reasonably inferred, according to the revelations that we have in the Book of Mormon, that God organized His kingdom, precisely to a day, 1,800 years after the crucifixion. Of course we do not learn this directly from the Book of Mormon; but we learn enough there of data on which to found a calculation.
1.God organized His Kingdom with the advent of His Son’s ministry, c. 30 AD.
2.Why the contradiction on where they’ve received their information? Is it from the BoM, or is it not?
We learn not only from this book, but also from the antiquities of the Jews, from the New Testament, from historians and from some of the Mosaic rites that Jesus was crucified about the time of the Passover, and that happened some time after the vernal equinox; and that 1833 years had passed from the time of the birth of our Savior before the organization of this latter-day kingdom.
3.Correction. Jesus was crucified at the exact time of the Passover, not ‘about the time’.
The way we come at this is by the account given in the Book of Mormon. We find that the ancient Israelites on this continent had a sign given of the exact time of the crucifixion and a revelation of the exact time of the Savior’s birth, and according to their reckoning, they made him thirty-three years and a little over three days old from the time of his birth to the time that he hung upon the cross.
4.Wait a minute – didn’t Mr. Pratt just state they didn’t learn this directly from the BoM?
5.Where’s the proof they wrote these things? According to LDS experts, the BoM is a matter of faith, not fact.
There is no doubt that the year of the ancient Israelites, who inhabited this continent, differed a little in length from our years; for they probably reckoned theirs somewhat after the manner of the Jews, at Jerusalem, and the Jews had formed their reckoning from the Egyptians, among whom they dwelt some four hundred years.
6.The Israelites did not ‘form their reckoning from the Egyptians’ contrary to what Mr. Pratt stated. Historical records state they used Babylonian names for the months of each year, but their calendar was the creation of God, not man.
It was based on seasons of the year, and important commandments God had given to the Israelites to perform at those times. Each had significant meaning which either pointed to the coming Messiah, or as a remembrance of what God had done for them.
The Egyptians reckoned three hundred and sixty-five days to the year; but the ancient Israelites on this continent, according to the records of the early Spanish historians, did not consider that three hundred and sixty-five days made up a full year, and hence at the end of every fifty-two years they added thirteen days, which is equivalent to adding one day every four years, the same as we do.
7.There are no records of early Spanish historians who can/will, or even have, validated stories from the BoM.
If such were the reckoning of the ancient Nephites, then thirty-three years and three days of their time had passed away between the time of the Savior’s birth and crucifixion. Now these thirty-three years and three days would, according to our reckoning, lack five days of thirty-three years. When we come to trace back all these authorities, we find that this very day, on which I am speaking, would be the close of the year, and that tomorrow, the 11th day of April, would be the anniversary of the very day on which Jesus was born; and the 6th day of April the very day on which he was crucified precisely eighteen hundred years prior to the organization of this Church.” – Orson Pratt, Salt Lake City, April 10, 1870
1 Timothy 1:4 “Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.”
Now, if you believe Mr. Pratt’s estimation on the dates of Jesus’ death and birth, I’ve got a bridge…
While we all know Jesus wasn’t born on December 25th, as of 2018, we still don’t have an exact date. The Bible simply states shepherds were in the field, which means it was probably early springtime. Luke 2:8
Additionally, there’s only speculation as to the exact date of Jesus’ death, making it impossible to come up with anything concrete. For every expert opinion, ten others are waiting in line. What we do know is that He was crucified on Passover, hence the phrase allotted to Him as the Lamb of God.
Lastly beloved, the Church’s track record of retro-engineering its own history makes even the date for Mormonism’s inception to be trustworthy.
Mr. Pratt’s insight was but filler words to take attention away from concrete information on where, and why our Lord was born, and crucified.
If you’d like to read about exact times, check out the Bible! Daniel
With Love in Christ;